Curse

freekedoutfish · Dec 09, 2007, 04:29 PM // 16:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yanman.be

el oh el pee vee eee! But, aren't thos lvl10's buffed to lvl20 style? So it doesn't really matter does it?

But why should they be buffed to the equilivant of a lvl 20 character just to play GWEN?

In all honesty, I can stomach the sight of a lvl10 in GWEN, I can understand the idea that you should be able go anywhere you want ingame, for the full openness thing.

What really annoys me is Anet basically making lvl10 players instantly the equilivant of lvl20 in strength and power, as soon as they enter GWEN.

That completely removes the entire point of working your way up to being powerfull enough to be able to handle these tougher locations. The entire point of a pve game is to develop your character until their able to handle the next harder locations.

Now you just make a new char, get them to lvl10, get run to the Asura portal and bing your have maxed attributes. Then the knock on effect being that you are now able to leveled up remarkably fast by taking on high end creatures that would otherwise have slaughtered you if you didnt have your attributes maxed out.

Anet might aswell just remove the entire point of pve and allow you to make pvp characters in pvp, fully maxed out and ready to take on any level of difficulty.

If a person wants to enter GWEN at lvl10, then fine. But they should still be limited to their existing attribute levels, because they chose to enter a tougher location earlier then they should have.

There was a time when you chose to be run through (for instance) prophercies into tougher locations like southern shiverpeaks. You did knowing you wouldnt stand a chance against the creatures because you hadnt developed your character to be powerfull enough yet. But you wanted max armor and gear from later locations or you wanted to be power leveled.

But there was still an understanding you character could not survive without help, because they werent powerfull enough for that area.

Now thats been killed!

I'm not suggesting a players level is important, but you should be able to look at a players level and make a conclusion like "they wont survive in this location" or "they arent strong enough to be in my team yet" (obviously im talking a lvl10 compared to a lvl20, not a lvl18 compared to a lvl20).

A players level in pve doesnt make a player, but it exists for a reason! To give you something to work for and develop and give an understanding of whether you can take on a creature or not.

To just enter a location and go from being lvl10 with no max attributes, to lvl10 with max attributes without working for it goes against this idea of role playing and pve.

Enter the location at lvl10 if you wish, but you find it extremely hard to play if you make that choice. You shouldnt be given an unfair advantage you havent earnt.

How does this effect the agro range for creatures? We all know lower level characters attract more agro from creatures of a higher level then them, so how does maxing the attributes effect that?

Do the creatures see them as lvl20s? If you enter a lvl20+ area as a lvl10 you should be the main target for any creatures. But if that has been effected then its just stupid.

Liberations · Dec 09, 2007, 04:31 PM // 16:31

I dunno. There will be more people there, and though they may not all be experienced, it's an oppurtunity for anyone who wants to bring their other, lower level characters into EotN. True, it does sort of cheapen EotN, but I think it helps Guild Wars be more accessible.

Meh, I don't care one way or the other. There really isn't any point complaining about a game that has been beaten to a pulp by all sorts of complaints from just about every type of person. Some people treat Guild Wars the way other people treat policitcs...

Uch... Politics >.<

Servant of Kali · Dec 09, 2007, 04:33 PM // 16:33

(from the other thread)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThyNecromancer

Is nobody a little ticked off at this?

I'm ticked off a LOT at people who biatch at every tiny detail. What exactly is the problem of non lvl20's in GWEN? If you don't want to party with non lvl20 then DONT. If someone wants to play as non lvl20 then WHY WOULD YOU CARE?

It's absolutely disgusting how many people want to have their own private sandbox. I thought people around me leave much to be desired when it comes to personal qualities, but when I see people in MMOs I thank God for people around me IRL.

Eric Cartman syndrome needs to DIE. For those who don't know what it means, it's a "all for me none for you" and "looking down on others and feeling good because they don't have what you do, nya nya nya".

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThyNecromancer

That new character you made and grinded to (...). Where is the fairness in this?

Fairness will be when all selfish grinders die. Then virtuous people will reign supreme.

Fools dwelling in darkness,
wise in their own conceit,
and puffed up with vain knowledge,
go round in circles,
like blind men led by the blind.

The Hereafter never rises before the eyes of the careless child,
deluded by the delusion of wealth.
"This is the world," he thinks,"there is no other";
thus he falls again and again under my sway.

* Yama - Katha Upanishad

(Yama = Vedic god of Death and Justice)

Liberations · Dec 09, 2007, 04:35 PM // 16:35

^
Well said.

I'm actually excited that my level 13 assassin who I never use can actually access a really fun part of the game. Makes EotN more worth my money, and brings it closer to the rest of the game.

With all seriousness, good move Anet.

Liberations · Dec 09, 2007, 04:42 PM // 16:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThyNecromancer

Is nobody a little ticked off at this? That new character you made and grinded to get to level 20 in order to into eotn was a waist of time. Now some scrub can get power leveled to 10 and go in. Where is the fairness in this? (and no, this didn't happen to me)

This is as fair as making it that you can start a brand new character in eotn at level 20 with the 30 attribute points. We paid for new content geared for level 20.

Thoughts anyone...

I see your point, but let me offer some insight.

Sure, they didn't work as hard as you to get in, but you still have your pride. You don't need to flaunt it off to everyone else. You worked hard, and keep that for yourself, and no one else. The level 10s don't have that.

arcanemacabre · Dec 09, 2007, 04:45 PM // 16:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

That completely removes the entire point of working your way up to being powerfull enough to be able to handle these tougher locations. The entire point of a pve game is to develop your character until their able to handle the next harder locations.

The point is: that isn't the point. In other words, Anet is letting everyone know that the level means nothing but a number.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

I'm not suggesting a players level is important, but you should be able to look at a players level and make a conclusion like "they wont survive in this location" or "they arent strong enough to be in my team yet" (obviously im talking a lvl10 compared to a lvl20, not a lvl18 compared to a lvl20).

This is true for other games. If you want level to be important to you, make a new character and level it up how you wish. You have that option. You can drag it out all the way through Prophecies, hitting level 20 in the desert at ascension. This is simply offering an alternative way of leveling for those who want it. Oh the heresy!

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

A players level in pve doesnt make a player, but it exists for a reason! To give you something to work for and develop and give an understanding of whether you can take on a creature or not.

It exists only for those who love to watch their numbers increase and to give people options on how they want to accomplish that. Aren't you the one who always says "you don't have to do it!" What do you care what other players do?

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Enter the location at lvl10 if you wish, but you find it extremely hard to play if you make that choice. You shouldnt be given an unfair advantage you havent earnt.

This is the real reason you're against it, isn't it? So, you would rather people rely on H/H or other players to carry them through, and they work as a liability, rather than equivalent to the other teammates. Those who want to level that way would do so regardless of their stats, this just means that they can contribute evenly.

Oh, but they haven't "earnt" the right to be an equal teammate just because they haven't grinded to level 20 the same way you had to? Yeah, you worked for it, everyone else should too, huh?

Loviatar · Dec 09, 2007, 05:08 PM // 17:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sleeper Service

it still is "high level content" its just that low levels get buffed to spec.

classic Anet fix and example of how they twist their way through things they said previously. Dont get me wrong i have nothing against it, but its annoying when someone repeatedly tells you such and such thing is impossible or/and that its just not going to happen and then they turn round and do it anyways.

they stated it would be level 20 contebt no low level starting area

it still is the last time i looked

they stated you needed to be level 20 to get the quest

they did not state and we will keep it level 20 until the servers go down.

give me one single flat official statement from Anet saying this would have a level 20 PERMANENT REQUIREMENT to het in.

one of those REPEATED statements

Neo Nugget · Dec 09, 2007, 05:09 PM // 17:09

It's not elite if you can beat it in under a day if you play straight through.

Silly Warrior · Dec 09, 2007, 05:16 PM // 17:16

Level 20 means nothing in this game. Almost everyone who plays has a level 20, and getting to this level is not "hard" in any sense of the word.

Anet realizes this, and is allowing people with level 10's to go into EoTN. Chances are that most of those people already have characters in EoTN that are level 20, and maybe have even beaten it. And if they haven't, why not give them a free trial and see how they like it, to make the player WANT to buy the expansion in his free trial time.

Its not like level 20 takes hours to do, its a very easy and simple task (in post searing) and you're acting like its a hard and well earned accomplishment.

Vamis Threen · Dec 09, 2007, 05:19 PM // 17:19

I've no problem <lvl 20s getting access. How many hours does it take to get to level 20 anyway? 6-8 in NF or Factions. Does anybody really think lvl20 means you are leet or something? rofl

The OP's reasons are pointless and selfish. He should go back to attempting to buy trade contracts for 100g.

Stormlord Alex · Dec 09, 2007, 05:30 PM // 17:30

I think it's an incredibly good idea.

Just because... Whine threads make me laugh.

Loviatar · Dec 09, 2007, 05:35 PM // 17:35

[QUOTE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

You shouldnt be given an unfair advantage you havent earnt.

think back fish

think waaaaay back

they havent earned it has been the main rallying cry of the epeen elitest since the first time Anet made something easier for the big mass of casual players.

Anet did the unthinkable by giving us a rune trader AND guaranteed rune salvage

rune prices will drop to nothing
i demand compensation for loss of farming income
THEY DIDNT EARN IT
we who have them demand everybody has to earn it like we did

every single thing Anet has changed that gave the casual player (which is actually most of us) easier access to the nice things to have fun with the same group has jumped in to yell

*THEY DIDNT EARN IT*

freak the way i see this is that i have several below level 20 characters i wasnt going to bother leveling up who will now see GWEN

i see opening a door to a whole lot of people who may enjoy GWEN and their having fun is good for me and the gamw EVEN IF THEY DIDNT EARN IT

Servant of Kali · Dec 09, 2007, 05:45 PM // 17:45

Oh, and I forgot. This thread comes down to:

"People who bought this game need to earn the right to play it."

I think GW2 should just sell with pre-searing, and then when everyone earns 10,000,000 grind points, they should be able to unlock Shiverpeaks but not before they spend 1,000,000 grind points on unlocking Old Ascalon.
After all, $50+ we spent on a game was just for pre-searing. The rest has to be earned. Again.

jezz · Dec 09, 2007, 05:49 PM // 17:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

But why should they be buffed to the equilivant of a lvl 20 character just to play GWEN?

um the only buff you get is HP buff...even when my ele from NF was level 19, Attributes were capped at 12(with runes)..same from level 10 till i reached level 20 then was able to fully allocate my points to the max.

i dont think it was a matter of low levels running around..they gave triple exp for primary quests..i think you willl find a lot of low levels will of played through till they reached level 20...in a rather short time.

Loviatar · Dec 09, 2007, 05:50 PM // 17:50

[QUOTE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ThyNecromancer

Dec 6th update

I thought EOTN was supposed to be the "elite" section of the game, hence all the dungeons and the fact that you had to be level 20 to enter.
Now a level 10 character can enter and they get buffed so that they can play in here.

What they did was go back on their word.. again.

you thought wrong thats all.

they stated all level 20 content no beginner area not elite content which is a big difference.

they did not state that they would not change the enterance requirements or any other change at some future time

this lets more people have fun and i am happy they did it as it does not hurt me a bit

Dr Strangelove · Dec 09, 2007, 06:04 PM // 18:04

Wait... people who play this game don't have level 20 characters already? Huh.

Why should I care what people do with low-level characters? It's not like level matters in this game anyway.

zwei2stein · Dec 09, 2007, 06:19 PM // 18:19

Thing is, there is nothing unfair about poeple being L20 when game was ballanced to be for L20 and when everyone else is also L20.

Levels never meant anything in GW, and its great that they start to mean even less.

EinherjarMx · Dec 09, 2007, 07:11 PM // 19:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Servant of Kali

Eric Cartman syndrome needs to DIE. For those who don't know what it means, it's a "all for me none for you" and "looking down on others and feeling good because they don't have what you do, nya nya nya".

That's the OP

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

That completely removes the entire point of working your way up to being powerfull enough to be able to handle these tougher locations. The entire point of a pve game is to develop your character until their able to handle the next harder locations.

I repeat, who said that the purpose of the game is get to lvl 20?
In factions, if you rush up moderately your char, you're lvl 16-17 by the time you get to kaineng, and there is where the real game begins or did you got to lvl 20 and stopped playing?
Your argument about the necessary and obligatory grind to get to lvl 20 is stupid

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Now you just make a new char, get them to lvl10, get run to the Asura portal and bing your have maxed attributes. Then the knock on effect being that you are now able to leveled up remarkably fast by taking on high end creatures that would otherwise have slaughtered you if you didnt have your attributes maxed out.

see, for veteran players, this is like a blessing, because they have been 5, 6 or 7 times (if not more) over the same content and the only thing they want is get to lvl 20 to start playing your so called "high end" content

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

There was a time when you chose to be run through (for instance) prophercies into tougher locations like southern shiverpeaks. You did knowing you wouldnt stand a chance against the creatures because you hadnt developed your character to be powerfull enough yet. But you wanted max armor and gear from later locations or you wanted to be power leveled.

But there was still an understanding you character could not survive without help, because they werent powerfull enough for that area.

Now thats been killed!

No, that was killed back when Factions was released.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

I'm not suggesting a players level is important, but you should be able to look at a players level and make a conclusion like "they wont survive in this location" or "they arent strong enough to be in my team yet" (obviously im talking a lvl10 compared to a lvl20, not a lvl18 compared to a lvl20).

Lol, if you think 8 skills > the other 56 of the 7 team mates then you must really suck, i consider myself good enough to get through a mission with one slot less than the max allowed, so, why not help?

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

A players level in pve doesnt make a player, but it exists for a reason! To give you something to work for and develop and give an understanding of whether you can take on a creature or not.

so, by your logic we shouldn't even try to kill glint because you know, she's lvl 30, 10 lvls more than anyone

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

To just enter a location and go from being lvl10 with no max attributes, to lvl10 with max attributes without working for it goes against this idea of role playing and pve.

I'be been playing this game almost since it's beginning, so al I can say is a big thank You to anet, that was a good move for us veteran players

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

Enter the location at lvl10 if you wish, but you find it extremely hard to play if you make that choice. You shouldnt be given an unfair advantage you havent earnt.

We got that advantage with tomes, i mean, i made a paragon and since i have unlocked every skill via pvp I bought her some tomes and started owning asses in noob island elona

oh wait, i shouldn't do that since i didn't earn it....

the op just QQ's because he could not have the braincells to avoid some grinding, texmod for carto "OMG! it took me 3 months and several pairs of eyeglasses to finish shing jea monastery, and now everyone can do it!!!!1!1onehundredandeleven"

prestige armor on a sub lvl 20 "QQ, QQ, QQ, why oh why did anet let them do that? i had to kill millions of chars and sold the charr carvings to buy my elite armor!!!"

"I suck, and i need the extra 15 energy from asuran or the 100 health from norn everywhere"

Sleeper Service · Dec 09, 2007, 07:17 PM // 19:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

they stated it would be level 20 contebt no low level starting area

it still is the last time i looked

they stated you needed to be level 20 to get the quest

they did not state and we will keep it level 20 until the servers go down.

give me one single flat official statement from Anet saying this would have a level 20 PERMANENT REQUIREMENT to het in.

one of those REPEATED statements

it was implied.

they weaseled their way out by buffing lower levels. When they said "end game content aimed at high levels" (etc) who would have thought that it ment "any level from 10 up because we will just give them a buff".

like i said. i do not care, they could let level ones into GWEN it would have ZERO impact on personal gameplay.

just saying that you cant trust a WORD that they say, and when Anet tells us they cant do something for X,Y, or Z reasons. Its a LIE.

Any btw when i said "repeatedly tell us that such and such..." i was referring to things like extra storage tabs, party search.

bhavv · Dec 09, 2007, 07:51 PM // 19:51

Firstly I dont understand why this thread has gotten to 11 pages.

Quote:

Originally Posted by freekedoutfish

What really annoys me is Anet basically making lvl10 players instantly the equilivant of lvl20 in strength and power, as soon as they enter GWEN.

That completely removes the entire point of working your way up to being powerfull enough to be able to handle these tougher locations. The entire point of a pve game is to develop your character until their able to handle the next harder locations.

This is Guild Wars, it isnt other RPG's. The main game is supposed to be grind free to play (Excluding certain titles, those are an optional bonus you dont need to do).

You can get from lvl 10-20 in a matter of hours, maybe about 4 or 5 of them. So whoop-a-dee-doo, a level 10 character going to GWEN and recieving the buff is not playing for an extra measly few hours to get level 20 before playing GWEN. Like it really makes any difference.

Guildwars has never been about working your way up to handle more difficult areas. Once you finish noob island, and get level 20 which takes like one or two days max, you are able to play pretty much anywhere you have gotten to as the level of the main game no longer scales. In the case of prophecies, you cant play the higher level areas untill getting through the rest of the game anyway, but that doesnt really matter in GWEN since it only takes a few hours to complete it all.

This whole thread and the OP is elitism in GW at the worst of the worst level.

ZOMFG I am lvl 20 and you are only lvl 10. HAXXXXXXX that you can play the same thing that I can ZOMFG.

Get off your noob horse and realise that level in guild wars DOESNT MEAN A FREAKING THING (no pun intended).